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        6                   UNIVERSITY OF ILLINOIS

 

        7                     AT URBANA-CHAMPAIGN

 

        8      

 

        9                      BOARD OF TRUSTEES

 

       10      

 

       11               SPECIAL DIALOGUE INTAKE SESSION

 

       12                      CHIEF ILLINIWEK

 

       13      

 

       14                 TRANSCRIPT OF NARRATIVES TAPED

 

       15                  IN THE FOELLINGER BALCONY

 

       16                        APRIL 14, 2000

 

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        1       SPEAKER:                 Page

               

        2       Robert Dunn                4

                Nancy Deters               6 

        3       Tom Bassett                6

               

        4       Cathy Harper              10

                Chris Drew                12

        5       Desere Untoob             14

               

        6       Noble Glaudell            16

                Nancy Henne               18

        7       Mark Butcher              19

               

        8       Matt Tittle               20

                Lori Kingery              24

        9       Leonard Malatere          26

               

       10       Yvonne Murry              30

                Diana Stimpel             30

       11       Daniel Green              32

               

       12       Nora Lloyd                34

                Frank P. Johnson          36

       13       Eli Suzukovich            38

               

       14       April Pierce              38

                Weylin Webster Williams   39

       15       Janet Tucker              42

               

       16       Ronald Jordan             43

                Bob Craft                 46

       17       Carl Kron                 46

               

       18       Stephanie Cord            49

                Jacqueline French         51

       19       Paul Youth                52 

               

       20       Susan Weaver              54

                Frank Krasnowski          56

       21       Gwen Carr                 57

               

       22       Anuj Parikh               60

                Sherry Naanes             63

       23       Bryan Thalhammer          66

               

       24       Matthew Pyles             67

                Ronald Black              69

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1       Arvin Gee                 71

                Dean Cook                 71

        2       Lindsay Robinson          75

               

        3       Nick Guroff               78

                Anni-Fridsantos           80

        4       Frank Trechsel            80

               

        5       Durango Mendoza           84

                Danielle Osler            87

        6       Jennifer Putnam           90

               

        7       Diana Regina Stimpel      92

                Felicia Graves            95

        8       Megan Bang                98

               

        9       Dianne Pinderhughes      100

                Matt Harsh               103

       10       David Anderson           107

               

       11       Cassandra Kegler         108

                Kateri Garcia            109

       12       Tamara Daniel            110

               

       13       Chad Daniel              111

                Meg Miner                114

       14       Kimberly Krinach         115

               

       15       Umeeta Sadarangani       117

 

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                                                            PAGE 4

 

 

 

        1                 MR. ROBERT DUNN:  As I said, my name is

 

        2       Robert Dunn.  I am a senior at Urbana High School

 

        3       and I have been involved in the movement for the

 

        4       last three years.  For the last, since I became

 

        5       involved and became aware of this at the high

 

        6       school, I have received numerous harassment,

 

        7       threats of violence towards me just because of my

 

        8       stance and I believe this is directly because of

 

        9       the University's symbol.

 

       10                 When people have friends who are native,

 

       11       you have kids coming up going "hey yaw, hey yaw,

 

       12       hey" and then afterwards they ask, why did you do

 

       13       that, and they said we are honoring you.  That is

 

       14       not honor.

 

       15                 I mean, if you want to honor native

 

       16       Americans, you live up to the treaties that you

 

       17       signed with them.  And I know that is all the way

 

       18       back from the 1800s, but those treaties still

 

       19       exist today.  And if you want to honor them, you

 

       20       know, include them into mainstream society.  But

 

       21       let them, let native people still have their

 

       22       religion, you know, stop mocking them for

 

       23       entertainment and then using honor as an excuse

 

       24       for your own personal entertainment.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1                 And you know, this stuff about the

 

        2       Peoria tribe, the Peoria tribe just passed a

 

        3       resolution, I don't know if anyone has seen it

 

        4       yet, but they just passed a resolution against

 

        5       Chief Illiniwek and they apologized because when

 

        6       Channel 15 came to them, which is our local NBC

 

        7       affiliate, came to them, decided that they did not

 

        8       know anything about Chief Illiniwek back in '95

 

        9       and had they known, they would have gone against

 

       10       it.  And so they feel really used by what the

 

       11       University has done by using their misquotes and

 

       12       misrepresentation of what they said.

 

       13                 And so, the only way to repay Native

 

       14       Americans is to get rid of this mascot and build a

 

       15       native culture house and native studies department

 

       16       and start recruiting native students, faculty and

 

       17       staff.  That is the only way, so please, the Board

 

       18       of Trustees, this University needs to wake up,

 

       19       this Hollywood, this ridiculous Hollywood stuff

 

       20       needs to go.  This isn't the 1920s anymore, that's

 

       21       when the Chief came around.

 

       22                 Also, what was back then in the 1920s

 

       23       was a little black symbol and if you look in your

 

       24       old past year books, you can see fraternities

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                            PAGE 6

 

 

 

        1       putting on black face and having little minstrel

 

        2       shows.  And so that's another thing you have to

 

        3       look where this came from.  This came from a

 

        4       racist environment and it still is.

 

        5                 So in conclusion I have to say retire

 

        6       this mascot, that is the only way that justice can

 

        7       be served.  Thank you.

 

        8                 MS. NANCY DETERS:  My name is Nancy

 

        9       Deters, I have been interested in this because of

 

       10       my kids, five of out of six of them have gone to

 

       11       school here.  And after I read all the good stuff

 

       12       and all the heavy duty stuff, what comes down to

 

       13       me is that if you have respect for another person,

 

       14       you don't have to love them or like them, but if

 

       15       you have respect and you are doing something that

 

       16       hurts them and they tell you that and they ask you

 

       17       to stop, then you stop.  It's that simple.  It has

 

       18       nothing to do with your intentions, you can have

 

       19       the best intentions in the world.  If it hurts,

 

       20       you stop it.  Thank you.

 

       21                 MR. TOM BASSETT:  Tom Bassett, the title

 

       22       of my presentation is "How Chief Illiniwek

 

       23       Undermines Undergraduate Education at the

 

       24       University of Illinois."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1                 My name is Professor Tom Bassett.  I

 

        2       teach one of the largest undergraduate classes at

 

        3       the University in the College of Liberal Arts and

 

        4       Sciences, Geography 101, the Geography of

 

        5       Developing Countries.

 

        6                 Each semester, this class has enrollment

 

        7       of 500 students.  The class fulfills the

 

        8       nonwestern culture requirement of the University. 

 

        9       One of the reasons that students are required to

 

       10       take such a class is that the University believes

 

       11       it's important that students are exposed to

 

       12       diversity of cultures that are different from

 

       13       their own.

 

       14                 It is part of our larger mission in

 

       15       preparing students to enter the wider world in a

 

       16       way they can act responsibly and intelligently,

 

       17       and I hope, with a sense of social justice as

 

       18       citizens of an increasing global economy and

 

       19       society.  This is a challenge.

 

       20                 Most of the students in geography 101

 

       21       come to the University with very little

 

       22       understanding of the world outside of Chicago

 

       23       suburbs.  The fourth week of classes I regularly

 

       24       conduct what I call a third world awareness

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                            PAGE 8

 

 

 

        1       exercise.  Students are asked to write down five

 

        2       words or expressions that capture the essence of

 

        3       the developing world.  They are then asked to

 

        4       write five explanations of why the third world is

 

        5       the way they described it.

 

        6                 More than 90 percent of the responses

 

        7       usually depict the people in places of Africa,

 

        8       Latin America and southern Asia in negative terms. 

 

        9       Corruption, famine, war, natural disasters,

 

       10       poverty, overpopulation and so on.

 

       11                 In discussion sections, we talk about

 

       12       the origins of these negative impressions.  

 

       13       Students invariably point to the media and its

 

       14       tendency to portray these distant lands in

 

       15       sensational terms as a way of getting the reader's

 

       16       attention.

 

       17                 My goal in conducting this exercise is

 

       18       for students to recognize that they have a biased

 

       19       view of the nonwestern world.  The repeated focus

 

       20       on disasters, tragedies and suffering creates

 

       21       negative stereotypes of nonwestern peoples which

 

       22       prevents American students from seeing the

 

       23       positive aspects of third world cultures.

 

       24                 In short, one of the challenges I face,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                            PAGE 9

 

 

 

        1       and one which I greatly enjoy, is to make students

 

        2       come to terms with their ethnocentric views of

 

        3       nonwestern peoples and to see that their

 

        4       perspective is just one of many ways of living in

 

        5       this world.

 

        6                 The presence of Chief Illiniwek on

 

        7       campus undermines my pedagogical objective of

 

        8       challenging stereotypes and making students come

 

        9       to terms with their ethnocentric views.  Although

 

       10       many students view Chief Illiniwek in positive

 

       11       terms, he is nonetheless a stereotype that hinders

 

       12       our understanding of American Indian history and

 

       13       culture.

 

       14                 The Chief's lineage is directly tied to

 

       15       Buffalo Bill's wild west shows, the Boy Scouts and

 

       16       Hollywood westerns.  These are notoriously biased

 

       17       views of Native Americans that are inappropriate

 

       18       in a university setting.  Dressing up and playing

 

       19       Indian for half-time entertainment is greatly

 

       20       disrespectful to Native Americans.  Imagine a

 

       21       South African sporting event in which an Africana

 

       22       dresses up as a Sulu chief and dances at half-time

 

       23       to the cheers of a white audience.  We would

 

       24       consider such behavior shameful in the context of

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1       the history of colonization, displacement and

 

        2       apartheid in that country.

 

        3                 Yet, we do it here on the campus of the

 

        4       University of Illinois.  Our government wave of

 

        5       systematic campaign of Indian removal and forced

 

        6       migration to make way for nonnative settlers, some

 

        7       would call it ethnic cleansing today.  Today we

 

        8       engage in the culturally insensitive act of having

 

        9       Anglo students masquerade as American Indians at

 

       10       our sporting events.

 

       11                 The contradiction between the

 

       12       University's mission of increasing student

 

       13       awareness of the diversity of places, peoples and

 

       14       cultures in today's society and the perpetuation

 

       15       of stereotypes that demean native peoples should

 

       16       be apparent to one and all.

 

       17                 Unfortunately, this is not the case. 

 

       18       The only appropriate solution to this

 

       19       contradiction is to retire Chief Illiniwek and

 

       20       create a new mascot and symbol that is befitting a

 

       21       first rate educational institution that purports

 

       22       to value diversity and respect for other cultures. 

 

       23       Thank you.

 

       24                 MS. CATHY HARPER:   I am a member of

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1       this community, I am not directly affiliated with

 

        2       the University at all.  I have lived here for 20

 

        3       years.  I will probably live here until the day I

 

        4       die.  My husband and I are raising three children

 

        5       in this community and it's important to me as a

 

        6       member of this community to not have the Chief as

 

        7       a representative of the University.  My kids are

 

        8       involved in sports and we go to sport tournaments

 

        9       and meets in a lot of surrounding communities, a

 

       10       couple of these schools have an Indian mascot as

 

       11       their school, high school representative.

 

       12                 I have noticed that at these meets there

 

       13       are hundreds of people walking across mats with a

 

       14       Native American's face on the floor.  I remember

 

       15       reading about Charlene Teters doing an art exhibit

 

       16       where she had a mat with the U of I chief and she

 

       17       had a mat with Abe Lincoln, everybody walked

 

       18       around Abe Lincoln's face, but everybody proceeded

 

       19       to walk across the Native American representative

 

       20       symbol face on the mat.

 

       21                 And I think that is emblematic of the

 

       22       damage that happens to people's consciousness

 

       23       about other people, people are just trying to get

 

       24       in the door, they weren't trying to be

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1       disrespectful to another person, but in walking on

 

        2       the mat as a matter of course as a matter of fact

 

        3       sort of thing, it communicates to themselves and

 

        4       other people, mainly Native American people that

 

        5       they, that they can be walked on and not

 

        6       respected.  So, I thought that was illustrative of

 

        7       what my concern is and I wanted to share it, since

 

        8       I had an opportunity to do it on camera.

 

        9                 MR. CHRIS DREW:  Chris Drew, and I am

 

       10       here to speak here for the Uptown Multi-cultural

 

       11       Art Center and artists who asked me to bring a

 

       12       message to the University.  The first, Lydia

 

       13       Tripone, for too long a period of time, history

 

       14       has not looked favorably upon the Native American. 

 

       15       We had misplaced our trust and we are still paying

 

       16       the price for that mistake, stereotypes throughout

 

       17       the ages, we have unfortunately become an

 

       18       endearing symbol of all that is primitive, behind

 

       19       the times and savage.

 

       20                 Our values and beliefs have taken center

 

       21       stage for your ridicule, your flagrant remarks and

 

       22       your total lack of regard for our ways of life as

 

       23       exemplified by your mascot.  We respect our elders

 

       24       and honor their place in our lives, the value of

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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        1       life and cherish it in all forms.  You will find

 

        2       very few Native Americans behind bars.  We

 

        3       understand the importance of what we do and the

 

        4       profound importance it will have on our children

 

        5       and our children's children.

 

        6                 Most people today value only one life

 

        7       form, theirs, and they will walk over anyone who

 

        8       gets in the way to their goal.

 

        9                 That begs the question, who is the real

 

       10       primitive person, the savage?  When you come to

 

       11       this country with no knowledge of the terrain, who

 

       12       helped you back on your feet.  Without us you

 

       13       would never have made it.  This is the things you

 

       14       give us.  We are human beings who demand respect

 

       15       and not your current form of half-time

 

       16       entertainment.

 

       17                 Carlos Cortez.  Having usurped the land

 

       18       of the original inhabitants, along with 300 years

 

       19       of genocide, you insult the memory of our elders

 

       20       by making mascots of them.  Even Hitler did not do

 

       21       that, congratulations.  Carlos Cortez, Coyote's

 

       22       Song.

 

       23                 And Robert Waupauhee.  Your people

 

       24       constantly use the phrase, we are doing this to

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 14

 

 

 

        1       honor you.  If that is a true statement, then we

 

        2       ask you, honor our wish and please stop.  Our

 

        3       community art center will publicize the struggle

 

        4       to help bring this institution of higher learning

 

        5       to a higher standard of human decency, one that

 

        6       rises above racism.  And anybody who has interest

 

        7       can check out our web site at art-teez.org.  We do

 

        8       the art of the tee shirt.  You can see us on the

 

        9       web.  Thank you.

 

       10                 MS. DESERE UNTOOB:  My name is Desere

 

       11       Untoob and my opinion about the symbol of the

 

       12       Chief Illiniwek symbol is that I really honestly

 

       13       believe that it's a racist symbol.  This movement,

 

       14       the Native American movement against racist

 

       15       mascots reminds me of the civil rights movement in

 

       16       the sixties.  The Native American people are the

 

       17       last -- minorities in this country are all

 

       18       struggling at this time.  But the Native American

 

       19       people are the last, most struggling minority and

 

       20       the most invisible minority in this country.

 

       21                 I am an alumni of the University of

 

       22       Illinois and I consider that a privilege to have

 

       23       had a very good education at this University and I

 

       24       believe that one part of my education is, has

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 15

 

 

 

        1       been, has given me knowledge to understand that

 

        2       Chief Illiniwek is a racist symbol.  I understand

 

        3       that it's difficult for people to see how it is

 

        4       because we are so trained to understand it

 

        5       differently.

 

        6                 But if you really look at the

 

        7       implications of this symbol, it's really obviously

 

        8       racist.  I have become friends with a lot of

 

        9       Native American people on campus and the

 

       10       protesters who come here and I believe that they

 

       11       have an incredible amount of courage to step out

 

       12       against Chief Illiniwek.

 

       13                 It makes me really sad that people can't

 

       14       see that this symbol hurts other people.  And that

 

       15       it's more important to certain people to have a

 

       16       symbol that they enjoy partying with than

 

       17       considering the feelings of other people.  This is

 

       18       a major University and I know that the reputation

 

       19       of this University is being tarnished.  So, I hope

 

       20       that this dialogue is truly a dialogue and I hope

 

       21       that the Board of Trustees decides to do the right

 

       22       thing.  It's actually very, very sad and a shame

 

       23       that we don't understand that this needs to be

 

       24       changed.  I am done now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 16

 

 

 

        1                 MR. NOBLE GLAUDELL:  My name is Noble

 

        2       Glaudell.  I represent six people who went to the

 

        3       University of Illinois, one lifetime Illini

 

        4       member, my son had two sons go here, two

 

        5       daughters, son-in-law, daughter-in-law and they

 

        6       all believe in the Chief.

 

        7                 I happened to find an orientation

 

        8       bulletin which I looked into and thought it was

 

        9       appropriate, because as you will note, the first

 

       10       thing that you read is, what is it?  Proud

 

       11       tradition, the Chief is a proud tradition.  He is

 

       12       unique, and as you go through the orientation

 

       13       bulletin, you go to academic excellence, some

 

       14       facts and motto, school colors, athletic teams and

 

       15       you get down to the last thing and it says spirit

 

       16       of the Fighting Illini Chief Illiniwek.

 

       17                 Everybody refers to him as a mascot.  He

 

       18       is not a mascot.  I called my kids back in '89

 

       19       when this was starting up and getting very strong

 

       20       and at the time I questioned them all and they

 

       21       said he is a symbol.  And that's what I feel.  I

 

       22       went to the University of Illinois Navy Pier, the

 

       23       representative thing that we had up there was what

 

       24       you call caricature and it was a picture similar

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 17

 

 

 

        1       to the Cleveland Indians Chief Wauhoo or whatever. 

 

        2       It was kind of a copy off of an apple box, which

 

        3       is what they use.  That is a caricature.

 

        4                 The Chief is not a caricature.  He is a

 

        5       spirit, it's hard to imagine it until I came to

 

        6       this school and observed things.  The Chief was

 

        7       just something that was going on.  And every time

 

        8       I saw him, it's almost like a religious

 

        9       experience.  Hair on the neck stands up and it's

 

       10       every time.  He does not do anything out of the

 

       11       ordinary.  They can say that he does a high kick

 

       12       and everything that is fine.  But if there is any

 

       13       Illini Indians around that would like to correct

 

       14       and straighten out things to a certain respect,

 

       15       fine.

 

       16                 What else can I say about the Chief?  He

 

       17       is a spirit, years ago at the time this was going

 

       18       on, Iowa would not let him participate at a

 

       19       football game at Iowa.  And Illinois was the big

 

       20       underdog.  At the time and I am sure the coaches

 

       21       used this, after they found out the Chief didn't,

 

       22       wasn't allowed to come onto the field and

 

       23       whatever, they sort of whipped Iowa.  They didn't

 

       24       just beat them a little bit.  They killed them. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 18

 

 

 

        1       They really did.

 

        2                 What else can I say about chief?  Every

 

        3       time I have seen him, I was fortunate enough to be

 

        4       at a football game when one of the local

 

        5       establishments went out to the west and bought his

 

        6       regalia.  It's not a costume, it's an actual

 

        7       outfit.  At the time there was an entourage, I

 

        8       think they were Cherokee Indians and a chief and

 

        9       the presentation was made on the football field at

 

       10       half-time.  Unless you were there, there was

 

       11       complete total silence when this was going on. 

 

       12       And the Chief could not speak English.  Did a

 

       13       prayer for the school in his native language and

 

       14       if you saw what was going on, there is no way the

 

       15       Chief is a caricature.  He's a symbol, he's a part

 

       16       of the spirit of Illinois, if the Chief has to go,

 

       17       then I say the trademark has to go and the

 

       18       Fighting Illini has to go.  Time is up.  Okay.

 

       19                 NANCY HENNE:  My name is Nancy Henne, I

 

       20       am from Bennett, Iowa, I am a Matisse, which is

 

       21       French and Indian.

 

       22                 And I have been coming over here

 

       23       probably testing for the last few years and very

 

       24       upset over this mascot issue because it makes my

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 19

 

 

 

        1       children and my grandchildren upset because they

 

        2       think people are making fun of us.  I don't agree

 

        3       with the idea of the mascot because he is wearing

 

        4       Sioux regalia, which is a sacred thing to us. 

 

        5       It's not to be made fun of, it's part of our

 

        6       religion.  The man dances with no moccasins, you

 

        7       won't find any Indian dancing in the arena with no

 

        8       moccasins, that is a mockery of our way of praying

 

        9       to the Creator.

 

       10                 Before he had danced with eagle

 

       11       feathers, eagle feathers are for Native Americans,

 

       12       they are not for just anybody.  I hear that this

 

       13       University here has ten headdresses that have

 

       14       eagle feathers in them that I have been told are

 

       15       here and should be returned back to the Native

 

       16       American people because each one of those feathers

 

       17       is supposed to be earned, not given.

 

       18                 I guess that's all I really want to say.

 

       19                 MR. MARK BUTCHER:  Mark Butcher.  I came

 

       20       here from North Carolina, I am against the idea

 

       21       that Native American heritage is being defiled in

 

       22       the eyes of our people and with little to say, the

 

       23       main thing I would like to say is we hear each

 

       24       other's words and as the words of people who have

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 20

 

 

 

        1       the authority to speak more wisely about the issue

 

        2       today are heard, instead of just with ears, I hope

 

        3       their words are heard with the hearts of other

 

        4       people so that the feelings of our people can be

 

        5       understood.  It's time for all of us to look at

 

        6       our heritage and to begin to understand the

 

        7       importance of having a mutual respect for each

 

        8       other.  That's my prayer and hope today.  That's

 

        9       all I have to say.

 

       10                 MR. MATT TITTLE:  My name is Matt

 

       11       Tittle.  I work at the University's Campus Honors

 

       12       Program.  I am an alumni of the University and I

 

       13       am still a graduate student of the University as

 

       14       well.

 

       15                 First I will start with a reading by a

 

       16       Native American writer, Margaret Thunderburg: 

 

       17       "They came for our land for what grew or could be

 

       18       grown on it, for the resources in it and for our

 

       19       clean air and pure water.  They stole these things

 

       20       from us, and in taking these, they also stole our

 

       21       free ways and the best of our leaders, killed in

 

       22       battle or assassinated.  And now after all that,

 

       23       they have come for our very last of our

 

       24       possessions, now they want our pride, our history,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 21

 

 

 

        1       our spiritual traditions.  They want to rewrite

 

        2       and remake these things to claim them for

 

        3       themselves.  The lies and thefts just never end."

 

        4                 Chief Illiniwek represents an

 

        5       unacceptable symbol of an oppressed people.  As

 

        6       long as this fictitious stereotype remains the

 

        7       University's symbol, the inclusiveness of Native

 

        8       American students, faculty and staff will be

 

        9       impossible.  Simply put, Native Americans are

 

       10       people, not mascots.

 

       11                 America is fortunately outgrowing its

 

       12       white male dominated belittling of minority groups

 

       13       and is learning to respect individual rights.  We

 

       14       recognize that representation of any minority

 

       15       group as one dimensional devalues the living

 

       16       members of that group.  Therefore, a sharecropping

 

       17       African America, a money hungry Jew, a gun

 

       18       slinging Mexican America or a Kyoto like Chinaman,

 

       19       a Playboy bunny or a Samurai warrior, would all be

 

       20       met with outrage, disgust and legal implications

 

       21       were the University to try to adopt such

 

       22       stereotypes as their symbol.

 

       23                 What would happen in Washington if the

 

       24       Redskins were renamed the Blackskins?  The result

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 22

 

 

 

        1       would be catastrophic because everyone recognizes

 

        2       the racial overtones of such an action.  How is it

 

        3       then that we can have a Native American

 

        4       stereotype, a Native American warrior stereotype

 

        5       as our symbol.

 

        6                 Some supporters recommend that the

 

        7       problem could be solved with a democratic vote or

 

        8       simply that years of tradition is more important

 

        9       that being politically correct.  The argument

 

       10       cannot be about majority opinion or tradition. 

 

       11       The majority has already decided that

 

       12       discrimination and racism is morally and legally

 

       13       wrong.  Based on years of civil rights

 

       14       legislation, ethnic minorities have been

 

       15       recognized and provided equality under the law. 

 

       16       To vote locally on Chief Illiniwek would be a vote

 

       17       on civil rights.  Those rights have already been

 

       18       guaranteed and need no further review.

 

       19                 In a town where the majority of the

 

       20       citizens were white supremacists, would a vote be

 

       21       allowed to determine if lynchings could resume. 

 

       22       Traditions change especially in recent years. 

 

       23       Women are no longer traditionally housekeepers any

 

       24       more than men are traditional bread winners. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 23

 

 

 

        1       African Americans are no longer slaves and Native

 

        2       Americans are no longer warriors or sidekicks.  To

 

        3       argue that Illiniwek represents tradition is

 

        4       unfounded.  Hazing was once traditional but is

 

        5       illegal.

 

        6                 If the University and Chief Illiniwek

 

        7       supporters are serious about paying tribute to the

 

        8       Native American heritage of Illinois, then they

 

        9       could do so in a more serious manner.  A monument

 

       10       could be erected to the Illinois Indians.  Native

 

       11       American cultural studies could be established at

 

       12       the University.  A variety of culture awareness

 

       13       events could be established.  Scholarships could

 

       14       be started.  At a minimum, Illiniwek supporters

 

       15       should each go to the Illinois Historical Survey

 

       16       Library on campus and learn what the Illinois

 

       17       Indians were really like and what happened to

 

       18       them.

 

       19                 I did just that and learned that the

 

       20       present day descendents of the Illinois nation

 

       21       number only in the hundreds.  They were

 

       22       effectively eliminated by white settlers as were

 

       23       so many Indian nations.  Our state and University

 

       24       are named after the Illiniwek Indians.  This is

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 24

 

 

 

        1       respectful.

 

        2                 As an alumni of the University, as an

 

        3       employee of the University, I am embarrassed by

 

        4       the symbol.  As an alumni of the University, I

 

        5       refuse to join the Alumni Association until the

 

        6       symbol is eliminated.  Thanks.

 

        7                 MS. LORI KINGERY:  My name is Lori

 

        8       Kingery.  I don't know what to say and speaking

 

        9       makes me kind of nervous, I have props here.  I am

 

       10       an alumni of the University, that is something at

 

       11       this point I am not proud of.  You know, I would

 

       12       like to be proud of that.  I know that I wouldn't

 

       13       give any money to the University of Illinois while

 

       14       they had Illiniwek in place.  He is not a chief. 

 

       15       That's absurd.  That is like saying he is the

 

       16       president of the US or something.  It's

 

       17       frightening to me that the Board of Trustees would

 

       18       put racism ahead, even if you call it tradition,

 

       19       you know, there are a lot of traditions in this

 

       20       country we are not yet proud of.  And it's

 

       21       frightening to me that they would put racism ahead

 

       22       of people.

 

       23                 Some of the things I have been noticing

 

       24       recently are the Employees Credit Union had a

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 25

 

 

 

        1       symbol that was chief oriented, you can't see it

 

        2       here, but they used to have it on all their little

 

        3       stuff.  They have changed it.  They have gotten

 

        4       with the program, sort of.

 

        5                 This is not very long ago, sometime this

 

        6       year, I believe, there was an ad for a local

 

        7       restaurant that is using chief logos or whatever. 

 

        8       The U of I says this stuff doesn't happen, we

 

        9       respect him, whatever.

 

       10                 But the most distressing one for me was

 

       11       yesterday's DI.  Pro-Chief, anti-Chief, what is in

 

       12       the sports section "Illini Chop Sycamores."  It

 

       13       doesn't happen in our community?  Yes, it does. 

 

       14       And it hurts our community and it hurts our

 

       15       respect of the University of Illinois and it hurts

 

       16       other communities when we go there to play sports

 

       17       and act like idiots like this.

 

       18                 And there is a lot more that could be

 

       19       said and I am sure that other people are saying

 

       20       it.  But I also think that it's strange that there

 

       21       is a big huge event on campus that has been

 

       22       planned for like two years that happens to be

 

       23       today, so you will see there are no women here

 

       24       pretty much because they are all in the Assembly

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 26

 

 

 

        1       Hall.  And all the women from the University and

 

        2       local businesses are crowding in the Assembly Hall

 

        3       for a women's conference that's been planned for a

 

        4       really long time.  This has been planned for a

 

        5       short amount of time.  And of course it's on the

 

        6       same day.  If you see the parking for this event,

 

        7       which is right across the street from that, there

 

        8       are like five cars there.  It's not seven in the

 

        9       morning, it's ten or something.

 

       10                 I got a letter saying that I could send

 

       11       e-mail about this thing.  It didn't mention the

 

       12       event whatever.  I don't think this is really a

 

       13       democratic process.  I think it's a farce.  Thank

 

       14       you.

 

       15                 MR. LEONARD MALATERE:  My name is

 

       16       Leonard Malatere, I am an enrolled member of the

 

       17       Confederated Tribe of the Flat Headed Indian

 

       18       reservation in Northwestern Montana.  I would like

 

       19       to come here today and my heart is heavy, because

 

       20       what, because of this ongoing issue of the Chief

 

       21       Illiniwek and other sports organizations who use

 

       22       Native American mascots.  And my heart is really

 

       23       heavy.  So I would like to come to share what I

 

       24       feel.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 27

 

 

 

        1                 And I would like to talk a little bit

 

        2       about Native American, the indigenous peoples of

 

        3       this land spirituality, the indigenous peoples,

 

        4       the original people of this land had a deep, deep

 

        5       spiritual connection with Mother Earth.  There was

 

        6       the power of woman who was made in the likeness of

 

        7       God, the Indian woman was made in the likeness of

 

        8       God.  They had the power to recreate herself. 

 

        9       They had the power to rule.  But in knowing this,

 

       10       she had to humble herself to allow the man who was

 

       11       made from nothing to have a chance to walk close

 

       12       to God.  And the man, the only way that he could

 

       13       walk close to God was through a vision.  And the

 

       14       vision had to be for the good of the people.  And

 

       15       in this way in keeping the scope on his vision

 

       16       through the entirety of his life, then man walked

 

       17       close to God.

 

       18                 And these people, these indigenous

 

       19       people were very, very spiritual.  We can't

 

       20       understand how spiritual they were, because they

 

       21       speak this foreign language, I speak this foreign

 

       22       language, this English, and I think in these

 

       23       foreign terms.  So I can't even begin to

 

       24       understand how the people a long, long time ago

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 28

 

 

 

        1       really truly felt.  But they had a connection with

 

        2       Mother Earth.  They had a connection, they had a

 

        3       love affair with Mother Earth.

 

        4                 And they knew some truths, they knew the

 

        5       truth that there was a Creator and in order to

 

        6       walk with that Creator, they had to live in

 

        7       balance and harmony with all that Mother Earth had

 

        8       to offer, not abuse her or misuse her, not

 

        9       mistreat her, but to walk in balance and harmony. 

 

       10       And they knew this as a truth.  And their whole

 

       11       lives they were seekers, great, great seekers of

 

       12       knowledge and wisdom.  The whole lives were spent

 

       13       seeking out knowledge and wisdom in order to

 

       14       better live in balance and harmony with the

 

       15       Creator and Mother Earth and all that they had to

 

       16       offer.

 

       17                 They were learners.  They spent their

 

       18       whole lives learning.  And they were also

 

       19       teachers.  They were educators.  They educated

 

       20       their children to live this life and to understand

 

       21       Mother Nature and all that Mother Earth and all

 

       22       that they had to offer.  They were great

 

       23       educators.

 

       24                 And their greatest blessing in life was

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 29

 

 

 

        1       knowing that they educated their children well to

 

        2       grow up with values and morals, to be virtuous in

 

        3       their hearts to have respect, that's what it was

 

        4       all about was about respect.  Respect for Mother

 

        5       Earth, respect for the Creator, respect for one

 

        6       another.  And they had no fear of death because

 

        7       they were very spiritual, they had no fear of

 

        8       death, they were brave, strong-hearted people.

 

        9                 What they feared, what they feared most

 

       10       in life was to be shamed, to be shamed.  And yet

 

       11       we had one of those indigenous peoples live not so

 

       12       far from this great metropolis of Champaign, right

 

       13       here in this area, we are walking upon the ground

 

       14       of the Illini people, these great, great people

 

       15       who were educators and lovers of Mother Earth. 

 

       16       They had a love affair with Mother Earth.  And

 

       17       right here today we have one of the great

 

       18       institutions, academic institutions of the United

 

       19       States, the University of Illinois at

 

       20       Champaign-Urbana.  And they are about teaching for

 

       21       future generations.

 

       22                 But I think they are excluding the

 

       23       Native American people out of this when they can

 

       24       make a mockery out of a great people like the

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 30

 

 

 

        1       Fighting Illini who were about education

 

        2       themselves.  What is going on here?  I think it's

 

        3       time that we all grow up and take a look at

 

        4       ourselves because if we can't be at peace within

 

        5       ourselves, we can't be at peace with all that

 

        6       Mother Earth has to offer.  Thank you.

 

        7                 MS. YVONNE MURRY:  My name is Yvonne

 

        8       Murry and this is my daughter, Diana Stimpel.  And

 

        9       she is a student here at the University of

 

       10       Illinois.  She's of Native American descent as I

 

       11       am.  And she is just starting her second year.  I

 

       12       am a public interest attorney.  I operate in the

 

       13       area of housing law in the city of Chicago but I

 

       14       am here today as a Native American and as a parent

 

       15       of a student here at the University of Illinois to

 

       16       say that, number one, that my gratitude to this

 

       17       school for providing such a wonderful educational

 

       18       opportunity for my daughter.  This has been one of

 

       19       the finest educational opportunities that she's

 

       20       had in her life, her short life.

 

       21                 Number two, I would like to say I

 

       22       understand and have talked to a number of

 

       23       University of Illinois alumni and understand their

 

       24       concern and their loyalty to the school and can

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 31

 

 

 

        1       appreciate how that has gotten tied up with the

 

        2       Chief Illiniwek as a symbol of the school pride.

 

        3                 And I am sure there is a great deal of

 

        4       confusion as to why the Chief elicits such a

 

        5       strong response from Indian people.  Quite frankly

 

        6       to me, it's the idea of the Chief sometimes is a

 

        7       little bit like nails on the chalk board.  And I

 

        8       suppose it would be helpful if I told you why.

 

        9                 Number one, the Chief Illiniwek here at

 

       10       the University of Illinois is a young man.  And

 

       11       generally Native American chiefs are mature

 

       12       Indians, mature men or women.  So there is really

 

       13       sort of this picture doesn't quite fit in terms of

 

       14       his role or his station in Indian culture.

 

       15                 Also, the Chief is dressed in

 

       16       traditional Indian attire.  Individuals that are

 

       17       dressed in traditional Indian attire walk slowly,

 

       18       dance slowly with dignity, measured steps.  And

 

       19       from what I have seen of Chief Illiniwek, his

 

       20       performances at half-time, it's a little bit

 

       21       frantic, at times I thought it was a little bit

 

       22       like Richard Simmons on too much espresso.

 

       23                 Number two is that Native American dance

 

       24       is spiritual in nature and when Indians dance,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 32

 

 

 

        1       what they are doing essentially is offering their

 

        2       prayers to God or to the spirits around us.  And I

 

        3       don't think that is the spirit or the intent of

 

        4       Chief Illiniwek.  It's more in the spirit of

 

        5       school spirit.  And team spirit.

 

        6                 Also too, I don't think that this school

 

        7       would allow images of African Americans such as we

 

        8       wouldn't have black Sambo dancing at half-time. 

 

        9       We wouldn't have a Mexican in a serape and a

 

       10       sombrero dancing at half-time.  All of these old

 

       11       stereotypical images, most folks, educated folks

 

       12       would think twice about presenting these images. 

 

       13       So it's difficult to come to terms with the idea

 

       14       of a Native American image taken so much out of

 

       15       context and allow that to be one of the symbols of

 

       16       this great school.  Racism, stereotypes perpetuate

 

       17       racism.

 

       18                 And as we know here at the University of

 

       19       Illinois, racism hurts, cripples and kills people. 

 

       20       And so I think it would be important to put an end

 

       21       to this misunderstanding of this imagery and find

 

       22       another symbol, one that is less offensive to a

 

       23       great number of people.  Thank you.

 

       24                 MR. DANIEL GREEN:  Daniel Green, I am a,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 33

 

 

 

        1       I am a member of the Ho-Chunk nation from

 

        2       Wisconsin.  And my concern for the logo or mascot

 

        3       issue is the context in which America knows Native

 

        4       Americans and that context is always the same

 

        5       regardless of commercial film, textbook,

 

        6       generational knowledge.  It's always the same. 

 

        7       It's an archaic image.  It's one of primitiveness. 

 

        8       It's one of unaccomplishment.

 

        9                 And my concern for that is that my

 

       10       children may grow up with the same low

 

       11       self-concept that I did, that my parents did and

 

       12       so on.  And that results in a suicide rate that is

 

       13       four times, four times the national average.

 

       14                 If you take a look at the socioeconomic

 

       15       statistics in this country, you will find Native

 

       16       America at the bottom, as a rule.  That is no

 

       17       accident.  And I think that has to do with this

 

       18       context, this bombardment that all of us are

 

       19       subject to have this image that is always the

 

       20       same.  I can't think of anything more antithetical

 

       21       for an institution of education or for anyone who

 

       22       has compassion for their fellow beings to

 

       23       perpetuate, to be a part of that that results in

 

       24       such dire consequences.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 34

 

 

 

        1                 I appreciate the time.  I appreciate the

 

        2       openness.  Thanks.

 

        3                 MS. NORA LLOYD:  My name is Nora Lloyd,

 

        4       and I am with the Women's Leadership Development

 

        5       Group from NAES College in Chicago, which is

 

        6       Native American Educational Services.  During the

 

        7       ongoing dispute regarding University of Illinois'

 

        8       use of Chief Illiniwek as their mascot, much has

 

        9       been said about the act of honoring by those in

 

       10       favor, as well as those of us against keeping the

 

       11       Chief.  So I think it appropriate to define the

 

       12       word honor for it is not a word to be used

 

       13       lightly.

 

       14                 We honor those that have gone before us. 

 

       15       Many laying down their very lives to preserve and

 

       16       thus honor their heritage, in other words, their

 

       17       story.  For what is more important to a people

 

       18       than their collective story.

 

       19                 Indeed, traditionally, every culture has

 

       20       held in highest esteem those community members who

 

       21       courageously honored their communal history and

 

       22       self-identify by making the ultimate sacrifice, as

 

       23       well as our elders to ensure that our nation and

 

       24       our story would continue on unchanged.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 35

 

 

 

        1                 With that in mind, I find the argument

 

        2       that Chief Illiniwek is honoring or paying tribute

 

        3       to Native Americans absurd.  Firstly, it is

 

        4       documented that the acrobatic gyrations performed

 

        5       by the Chief have no basis in traditional dance

 

        6       and is therefore a charade.

 

        7                 Secondly, wearing an eagle headdress

 

        8       considered by many tribes to be sacred while

 

        9       playing Indian, is an affront to those who earned

 

       10       the right to wear an eagle feather.

 

       11                 Lastly, using Chief Illiniwek, which is

 

       12       essentially a caricature of the Native American,

 

       13       as a merchandising gimmick is the ultimate insult. 

 

       14       What honor is there in misappropriating a people's

 

       15       identity for a profit.

 

       16                 Part of what makes us all human is that

 

       17       we are all participating in the cooperative

 

       18       community of humanity.  Many nations coming

 

       19       together while proudly retaining our individual

 

       20       stories.  I appeal to the Board and the University

 

       21       to end the duplicity and stop trying to rob us of

 

       22       our heritage.  From the beginning you have hidden 

 

       23       behind your intention to honor Native Americans as

 

       24       educators, many look to you to uphold a higher

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 36

 

 

 

        1       standard.  You now have the opportunity to

 

        2       practice what you have preached all these years. 

 

        3       Show the rest of the state and parts of the

 

        4       country how you define honor by not using a Native

 

        5       American as your mascot.  Thank you.

 

        6                 DR. FRANK JOHNSON:  I am Frank P.

 

        7       Johnson, MD, and I am very pleased to be here

 

        8       today.  Before I come forward with some of my

 

        9       thoughts that I sent in the mail a couple of weeks

 

       10       ago, I would like to comment that John Mennega,

 

       11       who is the chief, he is head of the foundation,

 

       12       the educational foundation for the Chief. 

 

       13       Marvelous speaker and a marvelous demonstration of

 

       14       reasons to keep the Chief.  Also, Jean Edwards did

 

       15       a fine job.

 

       16                 My thoughts:   While groups of activist

 

       17       Native Americans are likely well intended in their

 

       18       attack on Chief Illiniwek, chronic rage over the

 

       19       white man's dominance and ruthless annihilation of

 

       20       Indian culture fuels their anger and attack,

 

       21       preventing them from appreciating the symbolized

 

       22       honor, bravery and dignity of the Chief.  He may

 

       23       not be Indian authentic, but by neutral view, he

 

       24       does not demean Native American heritage.  The

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 37

 

 

 

        1       Atlanta Braves and many of their fans may be so

 

        2       indicted, but they are much harder to get to than

 

        3       a university.

 

        4                 It's more than likely that most Native

 

        5       Americans would not be disturbed by the Chief,

 

        6       although standing up against activist pressure

 

        7       would be difficult.  We are not dealing with a

 

        8       popularity contest in determining whether or not

 

        9       to keep, quote, the Chief.  But moreover, an

 

       10       effort to establish whether he represents dignity

 

       11       and honor, or is a trivialized mockery.  He

 

       12       represents dignity and honor.

 

       13                 Unfortunately, many who are more or less

 

       14       neutral regarding the Chief will be swayed by the

 

       15       strong emotions displayed by those who do not

 

       16       favor him.  Students and faculty would be the

 

       17       least inclined to identify with the history and

 

       18       tradition of the Chief who symbolizes honor,

 

       19       bravery and dignity.  Faculty are by and large

 

       20       academically oriented and students new to the

 

       21       experience of the Chief.

 

       22                 The alumni represent the most apt, those

 

       23       who are most apt to identify with his symbolized,

 

       24       positive value.  Organized objection is relatively

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 38

 

 

 

        1       recent.  During the earlier years, his dance and

 

        2       costume were modified by contact with Native

 

        3       Americans regarding these matters.  And I think

 

        4       that's what I got to say.

 

        5                 MR. ELI SUZUKOVICH:  Hello, my name is

 

        6       Eli Suzukovich, I am an alumni of the University

 

        7       of Illinois at Chicago and I am Native American. 

 

        8       My mother is Creek and Matee from the Matee

 

        9       Nation, Local 57 of the Daytro First Nations of

 

       10       the Northwest Territories, Fort Providence.

 

       11                 And when I was choosing schools, Urbana

 

       12       was not a choice for me because of this mascot. 

 

       13       It is offensive and it is sad that an institution

 

       14       that promotes education cares more about a mascot

 

       15       than, you know, the welfare of its students.  It

 

       16       shows that they do not care.  The University of

 

       17       Illinois at Chicago got rid of its Native American

 

       18       mascot in 1969 because they cared about what their

 

       19       students felt and what they thought.  And I think

 

       20       Urbana and Champaign should follow suit.

 

       21                 It's a new millennium, it's a new time,

 

       22       the days of vaudeville are dead.  It's time to

 

       23       move on.  And I think people, the motto, the

 

       24       traditions of this school should not be a mascot,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 39

 

 

 

        1       but should be education and the continuing growth

 

        2       of knowledge and as alumni I am saying that. 

 

        3       Thank you.

 

        4                 MS. APRIL PIERCE:  I am not necessarily

 

        5       pro-Chief or anti-Chief although I have been to

 

        6       events for both of them and I am friends with the

 

        7       Chief and the assistant Chief and all that.  But I

 

        8       kind of have a compromise, like an answer to the

 

        9       debate.  The pro-Chief side says that the symbol

 

       10       is dignified and it's an honor and all that, but

 

       11       then the anti-Chief side is saying that having a

 

       12       white college student dress as an Indian is

 

       13       degrading.

 

       14                 So, keep the symbol but lose the Chief. 

 

       15       So the University would still be called the

 

       16       Fighting Illini and have the symbol, but by

 

       17       getting rid of the half-time performance and the

 

       18       costume, then the anti-Chief people, that would go

 

       19       ahead and get rid of everything they are saying

 

       20       about the degrading and the stereotype.  And then

 

       21       everyone would be happy.  And that's all I have to

 

       22       say.

 

       23                 MR. WEYLIN WEBSTER WILLIAMS:  My name is

 

       24       Weylin Webster Williams, I am a member of the

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 40

 

 

 

        1       Odoah tribe from Sault St. Marie, Michigan, and I

 

        2       Seneca from New York, Tanawana Falls. 

 

        3                 Two words, Chief Illiniwek, is that

 

        4       right?  Chief Illiniwek.  First of all, there was

 

        5       no chief among these people hundreds of years ago

 

        6       or as it took place there was no chief upon these

 

        7       people.  So how do you create a chief that never

 

        8       existed?  Is it publicity, is it imagination, is

 

        9       it a fictional story written up that you guys made

 

       10       months, years ago?

 

       11                 Illiniwek, it's an English word

 

       12       probably, a French word, a German word, but you

 

       13       know what I am saying, it's not a word that we

 

       14       would say, it's not spoken in a language.  I guess

 

       15       that's why we are here because of little things

 

       16       like that, that I have a question if you guys can

 

       17       answer?  Do you guys serve alcohol at your

 

       18       football games?  And if that's a question that you

 

       19       cannot answer, it probably is a yes.  First off

 

       20       the bat, in our ways, our traditional ways from a

 

       21       hundred years ago, tobacco, yes, it's bad, but you

 

       22       know, it's 2000, alcohol, right off the bat, at

 

       23       pow-wow ceremonies, any place that we have a

 

       24       festival, a feast, a gathering of our people,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 41

 

 

 

        1       there is no alcohol allowed.  And that is honor,

 

        2       you know, we come clean, we come in those ways of

 

        3       all four directions.

 

        4                 So right off the bat you are coming at

 

        5       us saying that Chief Illiniwek is honoring us.  He

 

        6       honors all these people, gives them this great

 

        7       feeling of hope when they are at the game.  Only

 

        8       one man can do that, right?  But if you think

 

        9       about it, by half-time, you have a couple of beers

 

       10       in you, you are nice and mellow.  You look at this

 

       11       guy on the field, you are all like yeah, you know,

 

       12       that's sportsmanship I would look at it.

 

       13                 It's not honor.  It's not what we call

 

       14       honor I guess or respect, because we don't jump

 

       15       around making fun of other nationalities.  All

 

       16       right.

 

       17                 I know I have a lot to say, I have to go

 

       18       back downstairs and speak in a minute.  Questions,

 

       19       I probably will never get the answer to?  Where

 

       20       did Chief Illiniwek, he's not a chief, where did

 

       21       the mascot, who created the mascot?  I probably

 

       22       know where they got the idea from.  Why has this

 

       23       mascot not been terminated within the past ten or

 

       24       eleven years that this battle has been fought for. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 42

 

 

 

        1       It's just a mascot, it's the year 2000, you know,

 

        2       let times change.

 

        3                 Things are changing, things are getting

 

        4       more technology.  What we are fighting for is

 

        5       really simple, we are not asking a lot.  But

 

        6       people assume -- also I think it's for publicity,

 

        7       for ten years this school has been saying, oh,

 

        8       Chief Illiniwek, you know, you get that in the

 

        9       papers, you got more people looking at your

 

       10       college saying, it's a university, you know.  It's

 

       11       just publicity I think.  It's just a waste of

 

       12       time, a waste of money that you guys put into this

 

       13       school.  Like today we are sitting up on this

 

       14       board, or we are sitting here watching this board,

 

       15       they are sitting there, they are sitting there and

 

       16       they are getting paid to make a decision that they

 

       17       haven't made in the last ten years.  That's a nice

 

       18       little chunk of money in their pocket.  That's my

 

       19       time.  Thank you very much.

 

       20                 MS. JANET TUCKER:  My name is Janet

 

       21       Tucker.  This is my message.  The Chief Illiniwek

 

       22       entity should be eliminated because it is racially

 

       23       offensive to Native Americans.  No public poll

 

       24       results and no oratorical devices and no

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 43

 

 

 

        1       outpouring of sentiment can change the fact that a

 

        2       racially offensive entity has no place in a

 

        3       university that celebrates diversity.  Thank you.

 

        4                 MR. RONALD JORDAN:  My name is Ronald

 

        5       Jordan.  I prefer to be called Manapayga, that

 

        6       means warrior.  I am a pipe carrier in the Turtle

 

        7       Clan of the Oniack People of the Iroquois Nation. 

 

        8       And I speak to schools, many schools, I would like

 

        9       to come down here sometime and maybe speak about

 

       10       my people, because Native American history is not

 

       11       taught in schools, not the way it should be

 

       12       taught.  Usually it is either book learning, they

 

       13       never have any Native American experience, the

 

       14       instructors.

 

       15                 I was born and raised on a reservation. 

 

       16       I am strictly traditional Native American.  I

 

       17       spent 40 years working in a white man's world as

 

       18       an engineer.  I designed control systems for power

 

       19       plants, both nuclear and fossil.  So I come in

 

       20       contact with a lot of people, I traveled the

 

       21       United States extensively, from all the corners,

 

       22       from Washington state down to Florida, from

 

       23       California to Maine.  And wherever I go, the white

 

       24       people I come across have virtually no knowledge

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 44

 

 

 

        1       of my people.  And wherever I go, the first thing

 

        2       I tell them is when I leave here, you are going to

 

        3       be Native American literate, because I believe

 

        4       that I am a Native American ambassador to the

 

        5       white man's world.

 

        6                 If you have any questions about my

 

        7       people, ask me, don't accept what you see in the

 

        8       movies.  The movies are wrong.  Virtually every

 

        9       movie I have ever seen has nothing to do with the

 

       10       Native American people.  That's why we come to

 

       11       this Illiniwek issue.

 

       12                 I have a lot of protest against some of

 

       13       the terms and symbols and so forth that are used

 

       14       by the white people depicting Native American

 

       15       people.  I have nothing against the Blackhawk

 

       16       symbol which is what it is.  It's a symbol.  And

 

       17       it represents Chief Blackhawk.

 

       18                 I have nothing against the term Indians

 

       19       as in the Cleveland Indians.  What I am against is

 

       20       the derogatory terminology such as the Washington

 

       21       Redskins, and Atlanta used to have this clown who

 

       22       used to come out and dance, jump around when every

 

       23       home run was hit called Chief Nakahoma.  These

 

       24       symbols are exactly what I am against because just

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 45

 

 

 

        1       by looking at them it bothers us because it shows

 

        2       that the people who came up with these ideas have

 

        3       absolutely no knowledge of my people.  They have

 

        4       no idea, no concept of what our traditions are,

 

        5       what our beliefs are and what our taboos are.  And

 

        6       we come back to Illiniwek.

 

        7                 I have nothing against using the term

 

        8       and the symbol Illiniwek for the University for

 

        9       the ball teams.  What I have is against this

 

       10       mascot.  Those eagle feathers he is wearing, I

 

       11       understand somebody gave them to him.  They had no

 

       12       right to do that.  And being as I am a pipe

 

       13       carrier sort on the religious side of the tribe,

 

       14       these eagle feathers are very, very important

 

       15       religious articles to all tribes, not just mine. 

 

       16       All the Native American people.  We believe that

 

       17       when the Great Spirit comes down to visit his

 

       18       people, he comes down in the form of an eagle. 

 

       19       And when a warrior is killed in combat, he goes up

 

       20       as an eagle.  These eagle feathers represent

 

       21       spirits of dead warriors.

 

       22                 What I am asking you to do is study

 

       23       Illiniwek, find out where he came from, make sure

 

       24       that this symbol you are using is accurate because

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 46

 

 

 

        1       we do not believe it is.  And it would be better

 

        2       off if you didn't use it, because it's humiliating

 

        3       to us, humiliating and degrading to us and it

 

        4       makes you look all the more ignorant for using it. 

 

        5       Thank you.

 

        6                 MR. BOB CRAFT:  My name is Bob Craft.  I

 

        7       live here in Champaign, Illinois.  I would just

 

        8       like to say that I am a graduate of the University

 

        9       of Illinois, class of 1950.  I am a lifetime

 

       10       member of the Alumni Association and I proudly

 

       11       support the Chief Illiniwek.

 

       12                 I certainly endorse everything that he

 

       13       has done and hope that he will do in the future. 

 

       14       I think that I would be proud if I were an

 

       15       American native to be represented by such a first

 

       16       class individual as we have had each and every

 

       17       year.  Again, make no bones about it, I fully

 

       18       support Chief Illiniwek for the University of

 

       19       Illinois.  Thank you.

 

       20                 MR. CARL KRON:  My name is Carl Kron.  I

 

       21       am a life-time resident of the state of Illinois,

 

       22       born in Normal, raised in Makanda and I now work

 

       23       and live in Naperville, Illinois.

 

       24                 I have been concerned with the portrayal

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 47

 

 

 

        1       of the Chief Illiniwek for some time.  The thing

 

        2       that bothers me the most is the totally inaccurate

 

        3       portrayal of the Chief.  The stereotype that the

 

        4       Chief portrays.

 

        5                 Simply taking another culture, the

 

        6       Dakota culture and appropriating it in the Illini

 

        7       culture and then having a third misappropriation

 

        8       of having just simply white people then portray an

 

        9       inaccurate portrayal of natives.

 

       10                 I have been told that many, many times

 

       11       that the Chief is simply a revered symbol and not

 

       12       a mascot.  Fine, that is just words.  They say

 

       13       that a mascot doesn't run around and act crazy and

 

       14       do goal posting and such.  But however, when the

 

       15       symbol leaves the paper and turns into a three-

 

       16       dimensional form, that is in my view a mascot.

 

       17                 Purdue University has a mascot, it is a

 

       18       massive train.  I have never seen that train be

 

       19       goal posted.  And they call that train their

 

       20       mascot.

 

       21                 People say that the symbol is revered

 

       22       and it's not, not portrayed in the stereotypical

 

       23       form.  Florida State has this symbol.

 

       24                 Well, University of Illinois had the

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 48

 

 

 

        1       same portrayal of this running savage.  Well, you

 

        2       end up having Chief Illiniwek basketball, tomahawk

 

        3       and everything.  I would like to also point out

 

        4       that these are officially licensed products bought

 

        5       at major national retail stores, mainly K-Mart and

 

        6       such.  Another slam dunk Illiniwek, officially

 

        7       licensed version.  Honored symbol.  Tomahawk and

 

        8       menacing look.  Another officially licensed

 

        9       version.  This is the symbol which the athletic

 

       10       department says is the only, is the official

 

       11       symbol.  However, on the back you then have the

 

       12       touchdown Chief Illiniwek, again slam dunk

 

       13       Illiniwek with his Nike shoes.

 

       14                 So much for the honored symbol.  There

 

       15       is, you know, it's just a lot of it is just

 

       16       semantics, symbol, mascot.  The opponents of

 

       17       Illiniwek, you know, say that disparage the

 

       18       people, native people because they might be full

 

       19       blood, however, they build up people who are

 

       20       native ancestry and say, you know, this person who

 

       21       has ancestry supports Illiniwek.  This person who

 

       22       lives in Decatur who has native ancestry supports

 

       23       Illiniwek.  However, you take a person who is not

 

       24       full blood and they are disparaged.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 49

 

 

 

        1                 So, I truly urge the Board of Trustees

 

        2       to retire Chief Illiniwek.  Thank you.

 

        3                 MS. STEPHANIE CORD:  Hello, my name is

 

        4       Stephanie Cord, and I am a student here at the

 

        5       University of Illinois, a junior.  I graduated

 

        6       from a small town and grew up there all my life,

 

        7       it's only like 30 miles away from Champaign-Urbana

 

        8       so I have been familiar with the Chief and its

 

        9       debates all my life.

 

       10                 The first comment I would like to make

 

       11       is in regards to a comment that was made by the

 

       12       Native American tribe of youth from Chicago.  I am

 

       13       personally unaware from being a student here at

 

       14       the U of I of anybody being asked to ignore their

 

       15       identity and hide where their traditions of their

 

       16       families come from.

 

       17                 I also find it very disrespectful the

 

       18       way that the anti-Chief people are acting while

 

       19       the support for Chief people are talking.  I don't

 

       20       feel personally that Chief Illiniwek is a cartoon. 

 

       21       I think it's an honor that can keep the people in

 

       22       Illinois aware of the Indians.  When I was a kid I

 

       23       think when I saw Chief Illiniwek, it made me want

 

       24       to learn about Indians and their heritage even

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 50

 

 

 

        1       more.

 

        2                 As a matter of fact, when my family took

 

        3       me on a vacation, we were in Canada one time and

 

        4       there was an Indian tribe nearby, we were at a

 

        5       restaurant and I heard people talking about it.  I

 

        6       wanted to go, because I wanted to see their

 

        7       traditional dances and stuff.  So I think it made

 

        8       me want to be educated about the Native American

 

        9       heritage even more so than what I learned in

 

       10       school did.  I also don't see why people jump on a

 

       11       bandwagon to get rid of symbols like the rebels or

 

       12       Vikings or Sabers or anything that respectfully

 

       13       honors our past and our heritage.

 

       14                 I think that there could be a compromise

 

       15       made between the two groups.  The Native American

 

       16       people shouldn't see it as a discrimination, but

 

       17       they should see it as a way to keep their heritage

 

       18       alive.  And to make it aware, more people aware of

 

       19       where they come from instead of hiding it.

 

       20                 I was unaware also that students here at

 

       21       the U of I have been embarrassed of the Chief.  I

 

       22       have attended a lot of football games and

 

       23       basketball games and every time I leave or

 

       24       half-time, people stay around just to see the

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                           PAGE 51

 

 

 

        1       Chief.  And that's more ironic is when the Chief

 

        2       is done, everybody is so solemn and participates

 

        3       with it, and when is he leaving, everybody is

 

        4       yelling, I love you, Chief.  I never see anybody

 

        5       there hollering get rid of the Chief, I hate you

 

        6       Chief, anything like that.

 

        7                 So I just feel that it's an honor for

 

        8       our community to keep it, more than just as a

 

        9       tradition.  I think that U of I maybe on their own

 

       10       could take the steps to make the dance more

 

       11       authentic more than they have.  Thank you.

 

       12                 MS. JACQUELINE FRENCH:  Jacqueline

 

       13       French.  My parents names are Jim and Gwen French,

 

       14       they are both alumni from the University, class of

 

       15       1969, as is my older sister Stephanie French

 

       16       Raquel, who is now married to the former Chief

 

       17       Illiniwek, Steve Raquel.  On behalf of my family,

 

       18       we are very much in favor of supporting our

 

       19       mascot, Chief Illiniwek.

 

       20                 Growing up, I knew from my parents that

 

       21       the Chief was an honored symbol and they were at

 

       22       the football game present when the first eagle

 

       23       feather headdress was given.  So as a current

 

       24       University student, I am a senior graduating this